Itamar Marcus and Mustafa Barghouti Debate
In a follow-up video, Fox News reports on Hamas (Al-Aqsa) TV’s version of Mickey Mouse, Farfur, who, a week after being exposed by Palestinian Media Watch, remained on-air preaching messages of hate to Palestinian children. Farfur is the lead character for the Hamas Al-Aqsa TV program “Tomorrow's Pioneers.” The report includes a debate between Itamar Marcus, founder and director of Palestinian Media Watch, and Mustafa Barghouti, PA Minister of Information.
News anchor: "The Palestinian children show that preaches Islamic domination is still on the air... Well you certainly know about Farfur, the Mickey Mouse... that we've been reporting about teaching Palestinian children and others the lessons of hate, well we brought this story on the program last week about the mouse, and it set off such a worldwide firestorm, the Palestinian information minister said the show, called 'Tomorrow's Pioneers', would be suspended immediately. But that did not happen. In fact, the latest episode aired on Friday, and that fake Mickey Mouse isn't holding back at all. Watch this."
News anchor: "While Farfur was caught cheating and said that Jews destroyed his home so he couldn't get his homework, why is it still on the air? Well we're joined by, from Ramallah, Mustafa Barghouti, he's the Palestinian Information Minister who said the show would be taken off, and Itamar Marcus, founder of Palestinian Media Watch who brought the show to the world's attention. Why is the show still on the air if you've ordered it to be taken off?"
Barghouti: "It is not. It took a longer while than we wanted. The show has many mistakes in it. But it was stopped and changed, and next Friday, we'll see a completely different show. I think that this effort by some institutions to dehumanize Palestinians is not necessary and incorrect."
Anchor: "Mr. Barghouti, you talk about dehumanizing, I understand your view. But look, the mouse calls for the Islamic domination of the world, the defeat of America. Mr. Marcus, let me go with you. How would you respond to Mr. Barghouti?"
Itamar Marcus: "It's the Palestinians who are dehumanizing literally everyone else in the world by saying that Jews and Christians never had it better except during the periods that they lived under Islam. It's a total delegitimization of the Jewish traditions and the Christian traditions. And he's saying that they're teaching that it's going to be better again for Jews and Christians when they're living under Islamic rule. This is horrific Islamic [supremacist] education. And if our exposing this to the world is dehumanizing the Palestinians, excuse me, it's their own words that are dehumanizing them, and our exposing it is just letting the world see exactly what they're saying and what they're teaching their children. He's making the images of an AK-47, of an automatic rifle and dancing to the little girl reading about an automatic rifle."
Anchor: "Mickey Mouse with a machine gun."
Marcus: "Exactly."
Anchor: "Talking about Palestinian Information Minister Mustafa Barghouti and Itamar Marcus, who's founder of Palestinian Media Watch who brought the shows to the world's attention first last Sunday on this program, thank you again. Minister Barghouti, let me get back to you. We just saw the clip of this mouse, holding an AK-47, he's like throwing grenades. Is this the appropriate message to give to children in a children's TV program?"
Barghouti: "Absolutely not, and we don't agree with it and we think it's a big mistake and that's why we asked the station to correct. This is a private station by the way, it doesn't represent the Palestinian people or the authority, it's one of the 80 private stations that we have. We hope also that some propaganda machine, like Mr. Marcus propaganda, will stop feeding the hatred between both people. Let's find positive examples [for] children."
Anchor: "Let's go to the 'propaganda machine' as you say. Mr. Marcus, are you a propaganda machine?"
Marcus: "We're not propaganda at all. We're the ones who are promoting peace. By exposing the hatred, we've succeeded in removing hatred for years from Palestinian television and even to a certain extent from the Palestinian schoolbooks. But after the corrected number of things that Mr. Barghouti said [overtalk]. This happens to be the station of Prime Minister Ismail Haniyeh, this is the Hamas television station, so this is not a private station by any means. This represents the Prime Minister and the government of the Palestinian Authority. Another thing, the messages that the minister is criticizing so strongly now, these are the same messages we've been hearing for five centuries."
Anchor: "He promises that the mouse would be off so we'll be watching next Friday..."
News anchor: "The Palestinian children show that preaches Islamic domination is still on the air... Well you certainly know about Farfur, the Mickey Mouse... that we've been reporting about teaching Palestinian children and others the lessons of hate, well we brought this story on the program last week about the mouse, and it set off such a worldwide firestorm, the Palestinian information minister said the show, called 'Tomorrow's Pioneers', would be suspended immediately. But that did not happen. In fact, the latest episode aired on Friday, and that fake Mickey Mouse isn't holding back at all. Watch this."
News anchor: "While Farfur was caught cheating and said that Jews destroyed his home so he couldn't get his homework, why is it still on the air? Well we're joined by, from Ramallah, Mustafa Barghouti, he's the Palestinian Information Minister who said the show would be taken off, and Itamar Marcus, founder of Palestinian Media Watch who brought the show to the world's attention. Why is the show still on the air if you've ordered it to be taken off?"
Barghouti: "It is not. It took a longer while than we wanted. The show has many mistakes in it. But it was stopped and changed, and next Friday, we'll see a completely different show. I think that this effort by some institutions to dehumanize Palestinians is not necessary and incorrect."
Anchor: "Mr. Barghouti, you talk about dehumanizing, I understand your view. But look, the mouse calls for the Islamic domination of the world, the defeat of America. Mr. Marcus, let me go with you. How would you respond to Mr. Barghouti?"
Itamar Marcus: "It's the Palestinians who are dehumanizing literally everyone else in the world by saying that Jews and Christians never had it better except during the periods that they lived under Islam. It's a total delegitimization of the Jewish traditions and the Christian traditions. And he's saying that they're teaching that it's going to be better again for Jews and Christians when they're living under Islamic rule. This is horrific Islamic [supremacist] education. And if our exposing this to the world is dehumanizing the Palestinians, excuse me, it's their own words that are dehumanizing them, and our exposing it is just letting the world see exactly what they're saying and what they're teaching their children. He's making the images of an AK-47, of an automatic rifle and dancing to the little girl reading about an automatic rifle."
Anchor: "Mickey Mouse with a machine gun."
Marcus: "Exactly."
Anchor: "Talking about Palestinian Information Minister Mustafa Barghouti and Itamar Marcus, who's founder of Palestinian Media Watch who brought the shows to the world's attention first last Sunday on this program, thank you again. Minister Barghouti, let me get back to you. We just saw the clip of this mouse, holding an AK-47, he's like throwing grenades. Is this the appropriate message to give to children in a children's TV program?"
Barghouti: "Absolutely not, and we don't agree with it and we think it's a big mistake and that's why we asked the station to correct. This is a private station by the way, it doesn't represent the Palestinian people or the authority, it's one of the 80 private stations that we have. We hope also that some propaganda machine, like Mr. Marcus propaganda, will stop feeding the hatred between both people. Let's find positive examples [for] children."
Anchor: "Let's go to the 'propaganda machine' as you say. Mr. Marcus, are you a propaganda machine?"
Marcus: "We're not propaganda at all. We're the ones who are promoting peace. By exposing the hatred, we've succeeded in removing hatred for years from Palestinian television and even to a certain extent from the Palestinian schoolbooks. But after the corrected number of things that Mr. Barghouti said [overtalk]. This happens to be the station of Prime Minister Ismail Haniyeh, this is the Hamas television station, so this is not a private station by any means. This represents the Prime Minister and the government of the Palestinian Authority. Another thing, the messages that the minister is criticizing so strongly now, these are the same messages we've been hearing for five centuries."
Anchor: "He promises that the mouse would be off so we'll be watching next Friday..."
[Fox News, May 13, 2007]